Life Support Lionel 520

[T-Man]

This is about checking an engine to get it running. I purchased two today one without a shell Package deal. Both old and dirty. Engine one ran an inch. Two was quiet. Both are running now. I took pictures and will describe how I administered life support. I cleaned the motor and e unit. A fun time.

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/gallery/files/3/5/2/uglyduck.jpg

[T-Man]

The shell came off with one screw and I washed it with liquid soap and a plastic nail brush easy on the lettering. I had some oil spots on the inside and cleaned them with a Q tip and paint thinner. Both frames have rust spots so I will clean them up with a wire brush and dremel wheel and sandpaper. Then I will prime and paint.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1041.jpg

engine two shown. The e unit s to the right. You can see the windings and the arm. I removed the backside to the motor and cleaned the gear and area with thinner. used Lithium grease for lubricant. I then cleaned the wheels of rust and cleaned hte center rollers. THe wheels spun easily for cleaning with the gear removed. Wire wheel on the dremel did the trick ,a little 400 grit sandpaper helped too. The gear was put back on.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1031.jpg

A good underside picture. The left coupler is missing. The right is there.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1029.jpg

[T-Man]

The frame came off with one special nut . With a 5/16 nut driver I removed the brushplate.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1032.jpg
And saw this: dirt and the armature.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1038.jpg

The whole armature came out making it easy to clean the surface
One side is original, one cleaned with and eraser and one cleaned with sandpaper.
yes the divit had to go, more sandpaper.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1039.jpg

Q tip and thinner was used to remove the scum from the brushplate and motor area.
The top of the armature has the contact for the three windings. The copper surface (commutator)has grooves caused by the contact brushes. An eraser will clean it up but to get the grooves fine sandpaper 400 grit will do the trick.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1040.jpg

[T-Man]

The e unit can be the trickiest. This is engine 2. One screw on the side and you can remove it. At this time I look inside the motor at the axles and remove any built up lint. This picture shows the drum contact. six fingers touch this to reverse the motor. I used the Q tip with thinner to clean and used a pencil eraser to clean up the copper. I had black spots so I had to make sure I removed it all. The fingers were staight and I left them alone. Use the metal claw to rotate the drum for cleaning.


http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1036.jpg
Ths is engine one. Still dirty it worked.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1037.jpg

A simple cleaning and both engines worked. Engine one has an issue with the e unit lever more on that later.
The frames need painting too. Hope you enjoyed this I did.:)

[shaygetz]

I likes...needs a pantograph though:D

[T-Man]

Repro are available. Rare to have the original.
How about anti aircraft?
http://www.modeltrainforum.com/gallery/files/3/5/2/madduck.jpg

What it should look like.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/panduck.jpg

[shaygetz]

Oh...so it did come originally with a pantograph...cool.:thumbsup: I thought is was issued as a boxcab.

[T-Man]

The prototype was made by GE and the car pulled ore cars in Chile.
The car didn't come lighted.

Painted today. Sanded rust and used the Q tip and thinner to clean it.
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1043.jpg

I went with a satin black and aluminum. Heat gun helps in this weather.:D
http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel%20520/IMG_1048.jpg
The rust spots showed on the aluminum. Black hides well.

[T-Man]

The engines are done for now. I need some parts. They both operate fine.

http://i498.photobucket.com/albums/rr341/Railroad-Rob/Lionel/IMG_1055.jpg

This is by no means a closed thread. Comments please. I covered a few recovery tips here.Some apply to motors in general. To date I have not been disappointed in purchasing used Lionel. I enjoy the repairing.

[gunrunnerjohn]

I found this thread searching for a pantograph for mine. :D I think I may add lights to mine, I think I can sneak them into the shell. Even cooler would be directional lights...

Mine is actually in pretty good condition, no significant rust and all the parts are there. I just wonder if I should be modifying the shell of this one, it's in great shape with no cracks anywhere, even the problem screw hole.

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7421&stc=1&d=1297350677

[tjcruiser]

Gents,

Just out of curiosity, how would a real-life loco like that have been used? Passenger car service? Freight?

... or ...

Fighting aliens? T-Man ... you are always good for a laugh ...

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/gallery/files/3/5/2/madduck.jpg

[gunrunnerjohn]

I'm guessing this would mostly be either local freight or switch yard service. That's just a guess, mind you. I saw earlier in the thread they used them in Chili for an ore train. :)

[tjcruiser]

I ask this very unkowningly ...

It's not that common to have overhead electric trains on freight service, is it ???

[gunrunnerjohn]

Sure, I've seen lots of them on the run between Phila and NYC when riding the train up the NYC. Many tracks are electrified in the Boston - WashDC corridor.

[T-Man]

The prototype was made by GE and the engine pulled ore cars in Chile.
The car didn't come lighted. Directional lights with AC . My repro pantograh keeps popping off.

.

John, yours looks to be in great shape. I find it a fun little engine.
It would of been a good candidate for bluing.

So TJ, is it a prototype. One may have been in service in NY on the docks.


http://www.modeltrainforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=7422&stc=1&d=1297353382

The information was supplied buy D. Smith of CTT Forum (http://cs.trains.com/TRCCS/forums/p/171867/1886683.aspx)

[gunrunnerjohn]

Well, bluing would require me to strip the chassis. It does have some slight rust in places, so it would be useful to refinish it. Since it's now blued, that would be the best option.

My repro pantograph stays on fine, maybe you need a new one. The Train Tender has them for $6.

[tjcruiser]

Thanks for the real-life prototype info, guys!

TJ

[ram17x]

Hey all,
Sorry to barge in on your thread, but it's the best 520 thread I found.
I inherited a 520 set from a close friend; he got it new as a kid.
I have the complete circle set including transformer. Does anyone know about the set? Was it a Christmas special at the time?
It only has a Lionel coal car, Baby Ruth boxcar and a Lionel caboose.

My plan is to re-build the engine...it does still run as-is.
Thanks for the tip on where to purchase the replacement pantograph.
I still have a piece of the original.

Thanks
Rich

[big ed]

Well, bluing would require me to strip the chassis. It does have some slight rust in places, so it would be useful to refinish it. Since it's now blued, that would be the best option.

My repro pantograph stays on fine, maybe you need a new one. The Train Tender has them for $6.

$6.50 now John.

Hey all,
Sorry to barge in on your thread, but it's the best 520 thread I found.
I inherited a 520 set from a close friend; he got it new as a kid.
I have the complete circle set including transformer. Does anyone know about the set? Was it a Christmas special at the time?
It only has a Lionel coal car, Baby Ruth boxcar and a Lionel caboose.

My plan is to re-build the engine...it does still run as-is.
Thanks for the tip on where to purchase the replacement pantograph.
I still have a piece of the original.

Thanks
Rich

You have the link?

Traintender,
http://www.ttender.com/partslist.html

[ram17x]

Big Ed,
I pulled up the Train Tender website, but finding my way around
the Lionel numbering will take some time. If you've got a direct link, that would be great.
I need a few other pieces (body screws, bolster pins, etc)
I'd also like to replace some broken coupler pieces.
Any help would be appreciated.
I am an N-scaler typically....this O scale activity is just for fun.
Rich

[big ed]

Big Ed,
I pulled up the Train Tender website, but finding my way around
the Lionel numbering will take some time. If you've got a direct link, that would be great.
I need a few other pieces (body screws, bolster pins, etc)
I'd also like to replace some broken coupler pieces.
Any help would be appreciated.
I am an N-scaler typically....this O scale activity is just for fun.
Rich

Anything you are looking for say the 520 pantograph just click the parts # index to that # and scroll to 520. that would be page 4 it has the #'s


for 482-1U through 682-5. That part is listed as,
520-35 pantograph assy reproduction 6.50

[big ed]

You can call him too, he will know what you want and if he has it.

He packs everything in separate little bags listed with the #'s.

edit,

I can't link you to the page you want it just comes out with that page.

[servoguy]

Rich,
I thought it was all for fun. Did I miss something, or do you N scalers not enjoy what you are doing?:D

[big ed]

Rich,
I thought it was all for fun. Did I miss something, or do you N scalers not enjoy what you are doing?:D


It is considered fun with O because you can actually see what your fixing.:D

(I have N also Rich):D

[servoguy]

IMHO, anything to do with trains is interesting. My father has been dead for 33 years. I found out recently from my sister that he lived in a house near a RR track when he was 4 years old. He memorized all the trains and their schedules and where they were going, etc. I still have his collection of Trains magazine dating to Jan 1947. He was never interested in Lionel trains, although he did buy me my first train in 1950. He was a college chemistry teacher and apparently was not interested in the engineering of trains. When I was growing up in Emporia, Kansas, we lived 3/4 mile from the Santa Fe mainline. Periodically, we would go watch the trains. He knew when the Super Chief should go through, and so if it was on time, we would get to see it.

[T-Man]

My grandfather was a partner in a bus line. Not much interest in trains. Of course trolleys were popular then too.

This thread has a lot of general practice tips applicable to all engines, so you picked a good one to read.

[Dave Sams]

The shell came off with one screw....

Mine had 3 screws. The one that is often over tightened and visible from the end, and two on the opposite end accessed from the bottom.

In my case, it looks like someone removed the end screw and tried to pry the body off the chassis. The end is cracked, but they aren't visible unless you look very closely.

[T-Man]

I have two tabs on the other end, one screw.
I will say this motor does resemble a steam engine and it is one of the better threads to follow to clean up an old engine and check it to get it running. The skills here can be applied to all the electric motors and E units.

These motors are easy since they run without shells.
First I strip the shell and rods if bolted on. I remove gease. I clean and lube the armature and brush holder. Then with a jumper I bench test the motor. Then I clean the e unit. I clean the wheels up and track test it. I determine how the drum works. On the track the axles normally squeak and need oil too. On a good day twenty minutes, if I have no problems. Stuck screws are the worst problem and when working on an engine for the first time. If the screw head gets damaged and it does not turn you need to think about te fact that "Do you really need it removed?" I removed one from a side gear plate on a 1666 motor. I used a torch and got lucky. So on assembly use oil and don't overtighten. If the engine has rod nuts check them after running. They are not easy to find on a table. I just found one I lost over a year ago.:)

[ram17x]

Just a quick thank you to Jeff K. at TT.
Got all the parts I need to refurbish this little set for under $20.
I see why TT is a highly recommended supplier for Lionel parts.:thumbsup:

Now to decide if I want to clean the inside of the 520.
Still runs as-is, but clearly grimy....thoughts? tips?
I like to tinker with stuff, but don't want to get in over my head.

[tjcruiser]

GooGone, q-tips, pipe cleaners, soft toothbrush. Be gentle, and let the GooGone help degunk. Be extra careful around wire soldered ends.

Lube with 5W-20 or 5W-30 motor oil aftewards ... any spinning, sliding parts.

My two cents ...

TJ

[gunrunnerjohn]

For the plastic shell, I wash them in something like Dawn dishwashing liquid and warm water. Takes the grease and grime right off.

[Dave Sams]

Here is how my 520 body attaches to the frame. Notice the screws next to the operating coupler and wheel assembly.

Also T-Man, you are missing more than a coupler. You are missing the "2" from what I guess was a "2-4-2" steamer setup.

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae310/davesams/DSCN2552.jpghttp://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae310/davesams/DSCN2551.jpg

The Tandem Assoc page does not indicate any variation in the body mounting.

[gunrunnerjohn]

The Tandem Assoc page does not indicate any variation in the body mounting.Well now, they'd be wrong. ;) Note the screw, that's what holds the shell on. See below the chassis, and I can assure you no wheels were missing.

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=13363&stc=1&d=1323525786

http://www.modeltrainforum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=13364&stc=1&d=1323525904

[Dave Sams]

The other end of my 520 has one screw also. :)

[gunrunnerjohn]

Sure Dave, but look closely, I don't have the two screws you point out.

[big ed]

Sure Dave, but look closely, I don't have the two screws you point out.


It almost looks like Daves screws were added to it?
Maybe it was a fix Dave?
Custom cut washers.

[gunrunnerjohn]

I was thinking the same thing Ed, they sure don't look stock. :) It's certainly possible that there were variations in the cab design, it's not like that's never happened with other models. :)

[Dave Sams]

Some pictures of my shell.

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae310/davesams/DSCN2555.jpg

#520-5
http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae310/davesams/DSCN2554.jpg

The blocks where the self tapping screws look like they have been added during the mold making process. They are a part of the original body.

The glue is looks like a repair when the blocks were split by overtightening the screws.

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae310/davesams/DSCN2553.jpg

No evidence of slots for the tabs.

FWIW

[T-Man]

I looked at mine and noticed a tab broken, So one more tab nd I will have to go twith two more screws.

[Grandpa Railroader]

ram17x, What are the #'s of the cars in that set. Thank you

[T-Man]

U5Z7KG6Xgh8

This is not my video. To ask specific questions visit the owners site linked up below.

tmackinator site (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5Z7KG6Xgh8)

T mac has three sets the 1542 has the A babe Ruth, Caboose and gondola with canisters. 6014,6017,6012. To answer thwe question. The other two seta are uncatalogued with a chun king boxcar. The site explains it that I why I left the link.

[gunrunnerjohn]

How many of those #520's do you have? :D

[tjcruiser]

Great looking layout, T ... I especially like the wood truss elevated sections.

Someone you know, or just a YT find?

TJ

[T-Man]

That is a search find the owner has three sets of the 520.
You have to visit the site to see the information.

07jhB87Z6GY


This is not my video. To ask specific questions visit the owners site linked up below.
This is the grizz site (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07jhB87Z6GY)

[santafe158]

I ask this very unkowningly ...

It's not that common to have overhead electric trains on freight service, is it ???

Sure it was.

Many PRR GG1's ended their careers in freight service. Conrail went as far as converting #4800 for pulling freight only.
http://www.american-rails.com/images/PC_DK_GG1.jpg

The Virginian ran many electrified freight lines.
http://www.davesrailpix.com/vgn/jpg/vgn54.jpg

Those engines eventually went to N&W when it took over the Virginian. N&W removed the electrified portions of the lines and the engines were sold to the New Haven. They went down the line through Penn Central and Conrail.
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/cr4608.jpg

[ram17x]

Grandpa R,
My set has the slightly different cars than T-man.
I have the Lionel Line caboose # 6017, the Lionel gondola (no contents)
with road # 6112, and the Baby Ruth PRR boxcar # 6014.

Also, the cab on my 520 engine has tabs (one broken off) that tuck
into the frame. This is in contrast to the screw-type noted earlier.

Love the layout videos.:thumbsup:

R

[tjcruiser]

Nice info/pics on the electric freighters, SantaFe ... Thanks!

TJ

[dennisb]

Thanks for the detailed instructions on the 520, it helped me get one I had running again.

I appreciate it.

Dennis

[T-Man]

The nice part of this thread is the motor is typical of all the Lionel motors, each with slight differences. Cleaning is the same. The electric parts are similiar if not identical. The cleaning methods apply to all of them. The e unit too is typical and shows enough corrosion to want to throw it out, but it works when proper care is given.

All of the 50's instructions with sets stress cleaning and oiling, just about anything works. Mostly it is a matter of preference. It doesn't hurt to show some caution.