Tip: 'Toy' (Life-Like) Freight Cars and Turnout Derailing

[Necro]

I'm messing around and 'debugging' my configuration now and had a kind of scary thing happen. The engines all ran fine - no derailing on turnouts, no problems. So, I hooked up EVERY freight car I had and tried it to see if it would go. Note that all the stuff I have at the moment is from train sets and is Life-Like (read: cheap, plastic, and light)

Well...that didn't quite work as I planned. Basically, cars were derailing at every turnout, every time. Normally the car right behind the engine, but others randomly too.

So...I freaked, checked things out, tried both directions, etc. What I found to fix it was the following: add weight to the cars. I filled a freight car with coins and put my video camera in the log car (? - flat with sides). No more derailing. At all.

Going to do some more testing, but it seems like problem may be solved...now to figure out how to weight all the cars with fake loads...and where to get weights.

[tjcruiser]

Also check the gauge (distance between flanges) on the wheelsets of your freight cars. They might be out a hair (small or large) which could certainly lead to derailing. A common problem for cheaper stock.

TJ

[tankist]

gage is not an issue, the axles on these cheap cars are one cast piece of plastic, it simply can not go off gauge. the issue is quality in general IMHO. one thing that you can try is add weight.

also, what turnouts are you using?

[tjcruiser]

gage is not an issue, the axles on these cheap cars are one cast piece of plastic, it simply can not go off gauge.

Yeah, but the axles themselves can get bent or bowed. That tilts one side of the wheel flanges closer, one side further apart.

That said, I agree with you about aggravations associated with cheap cars and wheel trucks.

TJ

[Necro]

I'm using Bachman EZ-Track turnouts - the 'standard' turnouts.

[jzrouterman]

Well...that didn't quite work as I planned. Basically, cars were derailing at every turnout, every time. Normally the car right behind the engine, but others randomly too.

...and where to get weights.

In addition to the good advice that others here have given here, sometimes if the car behind the engine is like, maybe too small or too long for the length of the engine going through small radius curves, this will cause the couplers of each to bind against each other, causing the car to derail, especially when backing.

When several cars have a problem derailing at about the same time, inspect the track. Make sure there are no gaps between the rails, and that the track has been properly layed. You should be able to run your finger accross the top of the rails without any obstructions of any kind. Once you're satisfied with the condition of the track, take a look at all the couplers on the cars and make sure they are all flexible and working like they are supposed to. This is especially true if where they're all derailing is in a curve. In addition, if it is a curve at where the trouble is, what radius is the curve, as this in itself could cause the couplers to bind, resulting in derailments. After you've checked this, take a look at the rolling stock that is giving you problems. Maybe what your problem is, is not enough weight.

If so, then there is a laymen's way of finding out. If you have either an Athearn, Roundhouse or an Atlas car that is running great, compare one of these with the cars that aren't. Athearn, Roundhouse and Atlas are usually always correctly weighted. Hold one of the good running cars in one hand and a problem car in the other handhand. Notice a big weight difference? Maybe what you need is more weight in these other cars.

However if they seem to all weigh the same, than look at their wheels. Now look at the wheels on the Athearn, roundhouse or Atlas cars. See a big difference between them and your problem cars? If your prolem cars have plastic wheels. then you'll probaly need to buy metal ones, as most plastic wheels are not true. Proto offers an excellent selection of wheels. If on the other hand, they're made of metal, then take your finger and spin the wheels of each. Can you tell a big difference in the way your problem cars' wheels feel when spinning from how the Athearn, Roundhouse or Atlas cars feel when their wheels spin? Do the probem cars' wheels spin very easy and well, or hardly at all. If it's hardly at all, then sometimes this could be caused by a truck problem and not the wheels, in which case this is easily corrected by reaming out the holes on the insides of the trucks that hold the axles. micromart.com sells a little tool called an "HO Truck Tuner" that is made just for this purpose. I can attest that it works excellent in solving this problem .

As for the basic weight problem of some of the cars however, I went to Lowes and purchased some flat narrow pieces of sheet metal. (I prefer the steal over the aluminum, as it weighs more, therefore it takes less of it to work). A good way to do this, is to take one of these cars to Lowes with you or just take the weight from inside of the car with you. Show the attendant the weight. He will then know exactly what you're talking about and will lead right to the supply of these steel pieces. Match up the width of the steel pieces to the width of your car's weight.

Next, try to get a piece that looks like the same thickness of the car's weight or maybe even just a tad thicker as well. Avoid choosing anything too thick, as too much additional weight in multible cars can sometimes be too much for an engine to pull, causing it to sit and spin, so though it may be tempting, don't go for the real thick pieces. This metal is usually sold in three, four and sometimes six foot lengths, so you'll have enough to do several cars. After you bring a piece home, measure the length of your car's metal weight and then cut the new pieces of metal with a hacksaw or a jig saw equiped with a metal cutting blade, to the same size as your car's metal weight. Do this individually with each car, as not all cars have the same size weights in them.

In the past, I've used a miter saw, a radial saw and a tablesaw with metal cutting blades and have had equal excellent success with each. After you're finished cutting, sand the cutted edges a little. You'll then need to secure your weight to the existing weight in the car. I 've secured mine to the existing weight with a drop of hot glue to keep it from rattling around in the car. Of course you could glue it to the existing weght with a very tiny amount of Liquid Nails, However, be advised that this stuff takes a little while to dry, but once it does, the grab of the gluing will be there forever and will be almost impossible to take apart from the original metal weight for whatever reason in the future.

Once the weights are installed in all the cars, try the cars out on the track. The engine may be able to pull them accross level areas, but may have a problem pulling them up grades. If this is the case, either use less weight in each car, run with less cars, or use one or more helper engines, whatever your desire may be. Of course, all of this that I have offered here, are ways of how I dealt with some of these problems and by no means have been intended to appear to be the only solutions.

One thing I have learned over the years though, is try to buy the best quality locomotive and rolling stock that you can afford. Try to stay away from the real cheap stuff. If you do this, than about 90 percent of any future problems will usually be eliminated. I mean, as a general rule, most merchandise of model railroading is like most everything else. You only get what you pay for. This is especially true for locomotives and rolling stock. I know, as I found out the hard and costly way. Sorry that this has been so long, but I hope this helps.


~Routerman

[tjcruiser]

Routerman,

Long, yes. Informative? You bet. Well phrased and organized post. Thanks for sharing good tips,

TJ

[sstlaure]

I've been using some self-adhesive lead weights from A-line. Very easy to use.

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/116-13000

They also help in the pulling ability of your engines. My youngest has a Percy (Thomas engine 0-4-0) that could only pull 2-3 cars up the 2% grade of my layout. By adding 3 of these small weights Percy can now pull a 6 car train up the grade.

Also added some to a Proto1000 GP-15 that struggled with anything more than 8 cars - it now pulls a 15 car train up the hill no problem. (All of my cars are the newer, nicer model (not toy) style cars with metal wheelsets and knuckle couplers.) You'll know if this will work for you if your wheels simply spin when the engine is going (indicates plenty of power, but not enough tractive effort) The increased weight over the wheels increases the traction available.

I agree to try to aim for the nicer rolling stock/engines. Derailments take away from enjoying the railroad.

[Necro]

Thanks for the info all! (Especially JZ's long post).

Odd issue I'm having now is with the steam loco I recently got - the tender keeps derailing in turnouts. The engine is a 2-8-0 IHC one (Consolidation? L&HR on the side).

It runs great - much better than my cheapie Life-Like Diesels - except for this issue. (well, that and the light on the back of the tender doesn't light up).

[tkruger]

Thanks for the info all! (Especially JZ's long post).

Odd issue I'm having now is with the steam loco I recently got - the tender keeps derailing in turnouts. The engine is a 2-8-0 IHC one (Consolidation? L&HR on the side).

It runs great - much better than my cheapie Life-Like Diesels - except for this issue. (well, that and the light on the back of the tender doesn't light up).

Several steamers are notorious for having tenders that are to light. Same issue as several of the cheeper pieces of rolling stock. Try adding weight inside it.

[Necro]

I've actually noticed in testing weighting that I'm adding over the NMRA suggested weights to make things 'stable' (sometimes by an ounce or more). Is this most likely because of cheaper cars, bad track setup, or just more weight = better?

[sstlaure]

More weight will track better, and it can compensate for cheaper cars (plastic wheels), but too much weight will limit your ability to run longer trains.

I've changed all of my cars over to metal wheels and noticed an immediate improvement in performance (not derailing as often.) Even the cheaper cars are improved with metal wheelsets.

[Necro]

I have some of metal wheels and replacement couplers coming (damn you Hobbylinc! Mail my order!), so hopefully that will fix the remaining derailing issues (aside from my tender issue...I'll have to figure that one out still..)