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Old 08-06-2010, 10:58 PM   #11
Brooklyn758
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I think i found the solution .being the switches require a separate power source . Or need to be connected directly to transformer . when i run the isolated rail wire to 11 of the terminals . There is no completed circuit because there is not a ground . I need to ground center terminal on switch to the ground on transformer . those switches only get grounded when you press the controller button . theoretically it will work with 1 wire (if i dont add ground to transformer)if i hold button down at time of contact of train to to isolated rail.
Did that make sense? the windings in the switch is isolated from track .works its own circuit separate from the track circuit. Im explaining it complicately(Brooklyn word).
I found this and made me think of this now .

http://www.thortrains.net/maracc4.html
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Old 08-07-2010, 08:30 AM   #12
T-Man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyn758 View Post
the 3rd rail i isolated from the ground and center rail . I soldered a wire to that isolated rail and connect it to the switch on the green terminal .


( This is what I wanted to know)*************
When i mentioned center rail. I meant that if i make contact with a nail across center rail and my isolated rail which is connected to the switch for the anti derailment . It works fine. But when a train passes it does not .


.
The whole purpose for the isolated rail is to complete a ground from the opposite rail not the center. You are running current to the switch not from it when you connect the isolated rail.


IT is the axles that make the circuit complete not the the motor ground.
That is my simplest explanation.

I will read what you posted but a diagram would be best. The pole fed to the center rail should be the same fed to the coils. Not the same terminal but the same polarity. Both will work when contacted to the outer rail. That is what you need to do.

I checked an old switch and the Thor Diagram. Ground is also referred to as common. Now you have accessory power and variable train power on your transformer. Both have the same ground. The polarity for the center rail is the same as the black wire feed to the switch. The isolated rail connects to the red or green terminal. The train axles will ground out the isolated section and switch the switch.
You need steel wheels and axles for the connection. plastic won't work.

Your last statement makes sense.

With this information I will do a writeup on the Marx switch with pictures.
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Last edited by T-Man; 08-07-2010 at 12:57 PM..
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Old 08-08-2010, 05:29 AM   #13
Brooklyn758
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Thanks you were very informative . I still little fuzzy witht he hot common issue . But back to this subject.
The track and switch works fine . Meaning its connected properly and the track is made correct.
BUT my final conclusion . It cant work.
Un lees i can have a steady low volt 2nd source steadily powering the switch .
I say this becuase the voltage running the trains at a NORMAL speed is just not enough to throw the switch . These older switches resistance increases over the years and require high voltage as when they were new. and they require 12-16 50 yrs ago. 14 will throw them . But it will also throw my train 20 feet of the track in a turn. so i cant run a train at the high enough voltage ,safely ,for that configuration to work,
is it possible to have maybe 4 volts always cycling the switch ?I dont believe so .It would probably Melt the coil in the switch.But remember i have NO education or previous knowledge or was i around a person who knew about this stuff
Im just putting bits and pieces of little i read about electricity. I barely know how to use a multi-meter . DC i know more due to Car mechanics . In which i also taught myself .LOL Im pretty good at that .
Maybe if you explain to me how i can hook up a multimeter to the switch to see if and how much Volts (current) im getting at the switch at the time the train passes the isolated rail.
That would be a good test to see if its getting sufficient volts or if its working at all .
I did test resistance from isolated rail to terminal of switch. .002 so the solder-joint and rail and wire is conducting pretty good ,I guess. some rail end to end has a higher resistance,lLOL these track were totally rusted and oxidized .I cleaned them and sanded them where they are usable . these trains were my Fathers Toys when he was a kid.
let e know if you find something on these switches and wiring a anti derailment feature .
As to what I found ,Nothings says you cant . but nothing shows you how . Are these switches a rarer breed?they are the only switches i have at moment.
What do you think about my U.P. engines ?? 2023. they were totally nonworking. and all moving parts were seized and rusted together all wires were rotted also . Even Mold and oxidation on the plastic . Dont forget the battery Acid damage .They were not put away properly 45+ years ago.
I overhauled the and they run like new now . I still need the whole assemble for dummy car that contact the rail .Just for the lights and coupler . the contacts were rusted . Not even a wheel on the pick up.:-(

Thank you again . .
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Old 08-08-2010, 08:57 AM   #14
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Chris, next step is understanding your ZW transformer. Here is the link. I suggest you print it out.

The very first picture shows the terminals. A U is for the left throttle. The A terminal should go to the center rail. U to the outer.

Now B U terminals are for the switches, B connects to Black, U connects to your button( I think), but it is not needed for auto switching ( which is grounded off the outer rail (U)).

You don't need your voltmeter. You already know that there is not enough power to run the engine and the switch.

The manual may list voltages that you can check to see if your transformer has no problems. They do require servicing. The rollers inside wear out.

Use your volt meter to determine which lead on top connects to black. Connect B to that one. U to the other.


It is great, that you saved the 2023. We encourage everyone to revive old trains. To us they have more sentimental value than anything.
Show and tell us more about you layout when you get a chance.

Being a McGyver, think long term, and look for some used 022 switches, clean them up and replace the Marx switches. They have auto derail, already.
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How-To Column and Signature links Post number 4.


Links under O Scale Information


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkM...BLo3pJN1FGE1Gg

Last edited by T-Man; 08-08-2010 at 09:07 AM..
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