[jeffnohio]

hi guys just joined up.. and about 2 weeks ago started getting into ho trains and old marx wind up o scales.. anyway ,,

I just bought a mint in box old style mantua mikado steamer.. it has the open brush motor and direct drive worm gear right to the drive gear.. I have ran it on my track for maybe 1 or 2 hours so far.. The problem Im having is it will not run at lower speeds.. and when I put my 12 cars behind it it has a problem running even at full speed and slowes it way down..

Im using a bachmann transformer and have bachmann ez track in a large approx 4x8 oval.. my little bachmann 0-6-0 will run it just fine at slow speeds .. but there is no weight to it to pull that many cars and slips.. Is there a new motor I can put in this old Mikado to make her run better.. right now I want to stay with dc seeing that my budget wont allow dcc as of yet.. Thanks a bunch for any help .. Im pretty new and figured some one on here would know how to fix this or at least point me in the right direction.

 

[tkruger]

I have several of the Mantua 0-60 and 0-4-0 older steamers. They all use the same drive line. Your main issue is not the motor. Those old motors draw allot of amps. The basic Bachmann power supply cannot supply what is needed. An MRC Tech power pack (any one) will be a vast improvement. As for slow speed control the new power pack will also improve that. One with a nudge option will allow the older loco to start at a slower speed without the need to back it off. Look on EBay. The MRC Tech II goes for around $30 used.

 

[tjcruiser]

I have a Tech II power supply on my little HO layout. Bought it used, but it works great. Very good speed control, especially over the low-speed range.

Cheers,

TJ

 

[jeffnohio]

awesome! thank you for the info .. that is what it seemed like to me needed more juice.. .. I just thought all the transformers put out the same voltage.. that will give me another reason to put up some more track and have 2 trains going at once..

From what little info I have found so far about these old trains this has been the most helpful.. I had seen a retro fit kit motor on ebay for like $20 bucks .. but the motor looked the same.. im not sure how old this little sucker is but it was part of the 1860 general red box and had a piece of real wood as a spacer in the box between the cab and tender. I really like this engine, it's heavy die cast and just feels like a good quality train.. I can't wait for it to run like one too..

Thanks again and Im sure I will have a ton more questions. and hope sometime I can give someone some help out as well

Jeff

 

[jeffnohio]

Just bought a mrc tech II 1500 on ebay for 4.99.. hope this is the right one. it has a momentum switch.. is that the nudge?

 

[tjcruiser]

I have a different Tech model, but yes, I think that "momentum" setting will offer you good low speed powering control. They use something called "pulse" powering to help with speed control.

TJ

 

[flyboy2610]

awesome! thank you for the info .. that is what it seemed like to me needed more juice.. .. I just thought all the transformers put out the same voltage

They do. But voltage and amps are not the same thing.
From: http://www.youngco.com/young2.asp?ID=4&Type=3
Ampere - The unit expressing the rate of flow of an electric current. One ampere is the current produced by a difference in potential of one volt across a resistance of one ohm; An electric current flowing at the rate of one coulomb per second.

Volt - A unit of electromotive force. The electrical potential needed to produce one ampere of current with a resistance of one ohm.

In simple terms, what it means is that voltage is the 'pressure' of an electrical current, while amps is the 'volume' of electrical current. While power packs put out the same electrical force, they do not all produce the same volume. Your older motors simply needed more volume of current that the standard power pack was supplying.

 

[jeffnohio]

That makes more sense now.. thanks a bunch for taking the time too explain it..

also here is the retro fit kit .. but Im not sure if this would even work on my model.. seeing that mine doesnt have a gear box on the chassis..

I have another question about this Mikado... The way the boiler shell mounts to the chassis, There is a long screw right in the smoke stack.. (plus 2 under the cab). I have a drop in Seuthe smoke generator.. any ideas on how to go about trying to make this work on this train?

I have a drill press and taps if I should have to relocate the front mounting screw.. Just not sure if I want to totally ruin this thing buy changing it that much .. but I really like the smoke look on these old steamers... And Im all for customizing but Im not sure seeing that this is pretty old and in great condition.

Any tips, ideas or insight would be greatly appreciated

Jeff

 

[tjcruiser]

FlyBoy ... nice simplified description of volts/amps/current/power. Well said.

TJ

 

[tkruger]

I have another question about this Mikado... The way the boiler shell mounts to the chassis, There is a long screw right in the smoke stack.. (plus 2 under the cab). I have a drop in Seuthe smoke generator.. any ideas on how to go about trying to make this work on this train?

I have a drill press and taps if I should have to relocate the front mounting screw.. Just not sure if I want to totally ruin this thing buy changing it that much .. but I really like the smoke look on these old steamers... And Im all for customizing but Im not sure seeing that this is pretty old and in great condition.

Any tips, ideas or insight would be greatly appreciated

Jeff

Be carful if you choose to modify the frame. Some of them used a metal that is poured and not that strong. Stressing it to much can cause it to crack. Especially at that age. I have found that the smoke generators often do not work as well as one amy think in HO. The sped that is needed to make them put out enough smoke is to fast for realistic operation. Slightly to much oil an it spews all over. Also as you said the front connection of the frame and the boiler is threw the funnel.

 

[BHTRAINMAN]

Lube???

Another thing about these old mantuas, They sit around so long that everything sort of freezes up. I am currently restoring several,and the first thing I do is lube them "LIGHTLY" wirh a product called "Breakfree CLP ". CLP standing for Cleaner, lubricant, preservitive. It is available at most gun stores. The previous advice about the fragility of the "pot metal" castings is great advice too. Good luck, and let us know how thins work out.
BHTRAINMAN

 

[jeffnohio]

Hey thanks a bunch for the advice.. Im still mulling it over and not sure weather I wanna do anything to it .. But I will keep you guys posted on how it works out if I decide to add the smoker.. Break Free is great stuff I may have to try that.. for now everything seems fine with it .. I put some plastic safe oil on it I picked up from the Hobby shop for trains.. On all the driving rods and such..

Tried it out on the armature and it didnt like that.. so I cleaned it with some Mass Air flow electrical auto cleaner I have and let it dry and it worked great then ..No matter what I do though this thing is a noisy beast.. ON this ez track it seems to amplify it too lol ... I think Im gonna go get some thick felt and cut strips then hot glue it under the track bed.. I already cut peices of cork and laid in under it but the way this track is it is like a echo chamder on the underside..

Im hoping seeing that I may have 2 hours on it so far that the more I run it the quieter it will get .. .. Probally just wishful thinking though.. Im betting it is the open direct drive worm gear and open case motor..

 

[tkruger]

..No matter what I do though this thing is a noisy beast.. ON this ez track it seems to amplify it too lol ... I think Im gonna go get some thick felt and cut strips then hot glue it under the track bed.. I already cut peices of cork and laid in under it but the way this track is it is like a echo chamder on the underside..

Im hoping seeing that I may have 2 hours on it so far that the more I run it the quieter it will get .. .. Probally just wishful thinking though.. Im betting it is the open direct drive worm gear and open case motor..

Check the gear mesh. I have had to adjust it on some of mine. Some of their models allow the motor to move for and aft by loosening the motor mount screw slightly. If it uses two screws you can use a piece of paper as a shim on one side or another. With that in mind they are noisier than mid to high range modern locos. And you are correct that the EZ-Track adds noise. I use cork with flex and snap track, cuts down on the noise.

 

[jeffnohio]

I found a walk through on how to add smoke if anyone else is interested.. Located here http://yardbirdtrains.com/YBsmkunit.htm

 

[x_doug_x]

i seen it before, i've ordered a few parts from yardbirdtrains, i can say they are great people to deal with from experience. however, they were sold out of the smoke units when i ordered the stuff i ordered.

 

[jbsmith966]

Just bought a mrc tech II 1500 on ebay for 4.99.. hope this is the right one. it has a momentum switch.. is that the nudge?

Nudge? No.

What the momentum switch does is to regulate electricity flow at a certain rate no matter how fast you move the throttle switch.

Works both ways for speed increase or decrease.

The idea is that it makes your loco behave more like the real locos when getting up to speed or slowing down.

 

[jeffnohio]

Thank you guys for all your input and help. And yeah after doing some reading on google about the MRC tech II I got, I figured out what the momentum switch does. But thank you for adding it here too.. I went ahead and added the Seuth smoker I already had to it and it works like a charm. also added a moddified water tender that I added sound to, I pulled out the sound board from a IHC chug sound gondola.. It Sounds ok for now .. I had to use a really small speaker I robbed from one of my old cell phones.. I cant wait to find out more info on better sound boards or other options that work on dc.. This one just sounds like static but kinda gives the impression of a old steam engine.. It was a pain to mod the axle with the tiny peice of brass for the pickup but after some tinkering I finally got it.

 

[tjcruiser]

You young guys with your fancy, new, high-tech sound systems...

I've been running my trains with sound systems that are 5 and 8 years old. They kick out quite the chatter. The problem is, I haven't yet figured out how to turn them off. And ... I've gotta pay their way through college, too!

:laugh:

TJ

 

[x_doug_x]

post a video of it running with that smoke unit. i'm curious how good it works.

 

[jeffnohio]

post a video of it running with that smoke unit. i'm curious how good it works.

Here ya go .. This will be the first time uploading any kinda of vid so hope it works.. Also Keep in mind this is still running on the stock Bachmann transformer at full speed so the smoker will probally work alot better when there is more current being pushed to it with the MRC tech II Im waiting for.. I like it .. It really gives a good smoke trail .. Im using MTH proto Smoke. all they had was deisel or BBQ sent.. so I went with BBQ lol man Im getting hungry for some ribs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXLUItR-M7s