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I sold 2 MTH Rev L TIUs and a WiFi last year for a surprising amount of money. I then bought a MTH DCS Commander for $150 to run the 1 scale MTH engine we have and put in an order for the $350 TIU/WiFi unit yet to be produced. Could have ordered a 2nd and still been ahead on the sale. I'm all in on using an app v remote so the decision was easy. I had the TIUs because we have a dozen Rail King engines but are slowly selling those off as we move to scale using mostly Atlas and Lionel engines. We have Cab2 to run both Legacy and TMCC. The Lionel system is so easy to set up with the 1 wire connection and it works great. The DCS Commander is very different from the full TIU, but it bridges the gap until the new TIU is produced. Fully aware that even the end of year projection might not be realistic, still, I can wait. And if it never comes, that 1 scale engine becomes conventional. It's a different story if your collection is built on MTH, but otherwise, there's gold in them there TIUs...at least for now.
 

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I have a lot of Lionel and MTH locomotives, most all my stuff is command. I also have several spare TIU's, and I can fix then as they develop problems. Ditto for the Legacy systems. I have the Lionel and MTH WiFi boxes on the layout, and I have a spare for each of those.

I'm all in on using the dedicated remote vs the app, so I want spares of all this stuff. ;) The WiFi stuff is usually for visitors that prefer the app over the remote.
 

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When the 2 Premier Pacifics that I have ordered come in (hopefully in a few weeks), I don't see myself making any future purchases of new MTH product. If someone else were making the Pacifics I ordered, I would've bought from them. I think MTH's decision to discontinue a designated remote is very short-sighted.
 

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Good reason why I’m having my MTH engines converted to Legacy. Lionel electronics are still in stock, and should be for awhile
Do you have first hand knowledge of this? I'm guessing Lionel has some decent stock of Legacy boards, but they can't run from the parts shortage forever either.
 

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I'm not sure of the O-scale model train market's size. But compared to consumer goods it has to small, a niche market especially for the number two producer . Add to that the development and production costs of lower volume items like the command system and handhelds and it has to be tough to make a good profit on those items.

Believing that to be true, I think it was a mistake for MTH to come out with their DCS system. Had they chosen to be DCC compatible, they could rebranded control systems and electronics from a myriad of producers in the higher volume HO market. And their loco's would be compatible with many aftermarket electronics making them more serviceable with the ability to upgrade ... more valuable in the long term. Not an issue for the original owner that got out but a huge issue for the remaining "company(s) as more modelers shy away from their products thinking they're a dead end.
 

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I think it was a mistake for MTH to come out with their DCS system. Had they chosen to be DCC compatible, they could rebranded control systems and electronics from a myriad of producers in the higher volume HO market. And their loco's would be compatible with many aftermarket electronics making them more serviceable with the ability to upgrade ... more valuable in the long term.
MTH is DCC compatible with all their stuff from the last ten years. The sticking point is the big dog in O-gauge is not DCC compatible and won't run with DCC stuff on the tracks. Also, in 2000 when the DCS system came out, if they had instead gone for DCC with 3-rail O-gauge, IMO they would have fell flat on their face! One of the big calling cards for DCS was it would run on the same tracks at the same time with TMCC, that still applies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
doesn't there have to be a switch on the engine for dcc to work?

what about installing dcc and a switch to turn off dcc when running tmcc/legacy?

could you have dcc if you have 4 separate lines?
 

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[QUOTE="gunrunnerjohn, post: 2640895, member: 3481"

I'm all in on using the dedicated remote vs the app, so I want spares of all this stuff. ;) The WiFi stuff is usually for visitors that prefer the app over the remote.
[/QUOTE]

You probably have this right....stack up on the old technology for as many years as you think you have left on this earth. I did the same thing with Sony Betamax. Seriously, happy for you and just as happy with what I did. <mod edit: removed profanity>. Thought someone might be interested without getting into ITALICS.
 

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My main problem with the phone apps is it's a two-handed affair. The other gripe, especially with the Lionel remote app is the lousy throttle control.
[QUOTE="gunrunnerjohn, post: 2640895, member: 3481"

I'm all in on using the dedicated remote vs the app, so I want spares of all this stuff. ;) The WiFi stuff is usually for visitors that prefer the app over the remote.
Thought someone might be interested without getting into ITALICS.
[/QUOTE]I guess you don't understand emoticons... :unsure:
 

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My main problem with the phone apps is it's a two-handed affair. The other gripe, especially with the Lionel remote app is the lousy throttle control.

Thought someone might be interested without getting into ITALICS.
I guess you don't understand emoticons... :unsure:
[/QUOTE]
My bad. With Covid local community college courses cancelled. I'll enroll and get more hip! Sorry for sarcasm...the Betamax reference was pretty good though, yes?
 

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MTH is DCC compatible with all their stuff from the last ten years. The sticking point is the big dog in O-gauge is not DCC compatible and won't run with DCC stuff on the tracks. Also, in 2000 when the DCS system came out, if they had instead gone for DCC with 3-rail O-gauge, IMO they would have fell flat on their face! One of the big calling cards for DCS was it would run on the same tracks at the same time with TMCC, that still applies.
All that proprietary system work to run two different mfg.'s models on the same track at the same time. I run conventional. So I wouldn't know how important that is, and, what's the size of that market sub-segment that needs that. I'm say that presuming a simple switch can alternate between the two control systems on a single track (loop). Reinventing the wheel had to cost them and the buyer both in terms of dollars and functionality.

On another note, if the newer models can run DCC, wouldn't there be off-the-shelf (i.e., non MTH) replacement solutions for the control system - handhelds, et. al.? Or is the problem modelers have older non-DCC Loco.'s.
 

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On another note, if the newer models can run DCC, wouldn't there be off-the-shelf (i.e., non MTH) replacement solutions for the control system - handhelds, et. al.? Or is the problem modelers have older non-DCC Loco.'s.
The older locos, and I think if you have any TMCC/Legacy locos they won’t work either.
 

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I run mostly Lionel legacy with my cab 1. I refuse to buy the new cab3 and remote for the price they want. I can do anything I want with cab 1 for me. Yes there is a few things that the cab 1 won't work like the whistle steam and steam chest smoke I believe but then I don't used smoke. So no issue for me. Everything I would do with my trains I can do with cab one. I have a couple so I'm set for the future. . I don't want any type of WiFi and have to use the phone. I have used Cab1 since 1995 and it still works.
As far as mth I will buy no more engines, I have been selling off what I have and in the near future it will be all Lionel legacy.

Dave
 

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Dave, whistle steam should work with a Cab1. if you don’t see the steam either the switch is in the off position or the smoke pipe has an air bubble in it.

Pete
 

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I'm a bit concerned that the MTH crew is planning to drop the current app and create a new app to replace the old one. This is what it seemed like from their talk with TrainWorld. I'm really hoping it's just another free update to those that already purchased the premium app. If this crew just implemented the remaining features from the legacy protocol, they would already have an advantage over the Cab 3 and Base 3.
 

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I'm not holding my breath, for what ever happens. How old is DCS? over twenty now with no major changes, just slight improvements and add ons. Even the app hasn't changed since release, they sure haven't fixed the bugs I keep experiencing with it hence I don't use it anymore. Just a backup in case my remote dies.
 

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We use DCS and are at the point of connecting a second TIU and transformer, both of which we have along with two spare AIUs. We have 3-4 remotes and also run Legacy with 3 remotes. The layout has @ 35 turnouts and everything works okay BUT we are concerned with the future and what appears to be a lack of depth at MTH.

Has anyone considered changing from DCS to Legacy. And info would be appreciated as we know very little about the Lionel control system. Switching would involve selling or upgrading 10-12 MTH engines and who knows what else.

Thanks for the assistance.
 

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If the new MTH DCS company doesn't come through and goes out of business, I would expect some third party to make a box that emulates DCS signals operable through the Lionel Base 3 down the road. In this scenario, it's even possible that Lionel would make such an emulator, perhaps licensed from the remnant MTH company. So don't worry, be happy for now.

You can alter PS2 and PS3 locos to TMCC for about $100-200 each (if you do the work yourself) using ERR modules. Cost increases if you want digital sound.

This is a changing market in terms of costs, of course, with everything on the increase. Personally, I'd just keep using the DCS system until it dies or replacements are available. If the replacements don't reach the market, then make the decisions that work best for you.
 

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Thanks. Kinda of what our thoughts have been on locomotives. Handling the turnouts, track power, etc is a big concern and could be expensive. We can always do that with a control board, manual switches Fairly easily.
 
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