Model Train Forum banner
1041 - 1060 of 1096 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,549 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,041 ·
Thats a DEAL. The large motor is worth that. Large motor Hudsons are going for near $300.00 on ebay. Did the seller know it had the large motor? Nice score.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,358 Posts
Not sure I have bought af stuff from him I bought my 336 from 175.00 needed work.. came out great actually he wanted 125.00 be he sold it to me for 100.00 he had a diesel comet go shape wanted 90. He offered me 75. Funds were low. Wait for the big show in January in Springfield mass 4 buildings of trains. Saving bucks for that.lol
Al
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,549 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,045 ·
Timmy, AF has a regular size motor and the large motor. A bigger motor.
I do not see much difference in power but the large motor is preferred.
Only a few Flyers had the choice of motors.

Here are a couple pics of a locomotive I have been waiting to arrive.
Its made by American Models. Its a GP9. Texas and Pacific RR.
I like it. NIB.

Train Plant Rolling stock Tree Vehicle



Train Sky Plant Vehicle Track
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
Looks like it was worth the wait.
The term large motor was used in reference to steam engines. Coincident with the addition of traction tires Gilbert also began using larger motors, the armature lamination stack is 24/32" rather than 18/32". Not all traction tire engines got the large motor in the first two years. Large motors are apparent from the underside of the cab. During later years of production the armature changed from a disc to a drum design. Gilbert referred to the larger armatures as "super armatures." The fields were also revised to work with the super armatures.
The diesel motors underwent similar revisions but they are rarely discussed because it requires an engine disassembly to see which parts are in the motor.
Most revisions after 1956 were not performance improvements but rather cost reductions.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
Looks like it was worth the wait.
The term large motor was used in reference to steam engines. Coincident with the addition of traction tires Gilbert also began using larger motors, the armature lamination stack is 24/32" rather than 18/32". Not all traction tire engines got the large motor in the first two years. Large motors are apparent from the underside of the cab. During later years of production the armature changed from a disc to a drum design. Gilbert referred to the larger armatures as "super armatures." The fields were also revised to work with the super armatures.
The diesel motors underwent similar revisions but they are rarely discussed because it requires an engine disassembly to see which parts are in the motor.
Most revisions after 1956 were not performance improvements but rather cost reductions.
Thanks Tom. So are there 'large motor' units that still use the disc armature, or is the disc vs. drum armature an indicator of pulmor engine vs. the older 'smaller' engines? Thanks! And that GP9 looks beautiful!
TimmyD
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
All the steam engines of interest with large motors have disc type commutators. The redesign with a drum commutator was after the change to 5 digit numbering. Engines with this motor would also have two step reverse units making them, in my opinion, suitable for display purposes, not for routine operation. Many 5 digit engines with drum commutator motors are also small 1/2" designs. Another cost reduction that reduced performance and reliability.
Five digit Hudsons would be the 21129 and 21130. My 21130 runs ok because of the sliding pickup shoes but I am on borrowed time until the reverse unit fails. The 21130 costs more than a 326. The 21129 in excellent condition sells for over $1k. The LNOB example I looked at was over $1,500, I never felt I needed one that bad.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
All the steam engines of interest with large motors have disc type commutators. The redesign with a drum commutator was after the change to 5 digit numbering. Engines with this motor would also have two step reverse units making them, in my opinion, suitable for display purposes, not for routine operation. Many 5 digit engines with drum commutator motors are also small 1/2" designs. Another cost reduction that reduced performance and reliability.
Five digit Hudsons would be the 21129 and 21130. My 21130 runs ok because of the sliding pickup shoes but I am on borrowed time until the reverse unit fails. The 21130 costs more than a 326. The 21129 in excellent condition sells for over $1k. The LNOB example I looked at was over $1,500, I never felt I needed one that bad.
Thanks Tom!
I think I am squarely interested in the post war 3 digit stuff as well. Anyway, I didn't mean for the tangent in this thread but appreciate the information. I will get some pics in here soon, but they won't be all pretty like the ones ampac is posting! I am just getting into this space, so not much fancy stuff, and all intended to be runners. I did pick up a 314AW though, so that my dad's train will be whole again. Maybe I will try and rebuild his old train over time, but the one I picked up was just a few dollars more than the reverse unit/whistle assembly alone on ebay. Since I am basically just starting from a frame with drive wheels, I am not sure it is worth it to piece it together, financially anyway. Even the field has clipped magnet wire.
Take care all,
TimmyD
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
For contrast here is my PRR GP9. With the dark paint many of the details visible on Mopac's T&P engine are not apparent on the PRR. What can I do since I am modelling PRR territory other than own a fleet of mostly boring engines. For color I added a picture of the Christmas REA TOFC, one of my favorites.

Train Rolling stock Track Vehicle Electricity
Train Wheel Plant Motor vehicle Rolling stock
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,549 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,051 ·
Tom, one of the items I hope to get this week is a REA TOFC. not Christmas trailers though. I think I already
have one but that is ok. If one is good two is better. I also have a PRR box car coming. Not sure of the number.
It may be a double also.

I need a couple Lionel S scale RailSounds Box cars. I just never see them for sale. New would be preferred.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
The Freight Sounds boxcars are still available new from dealers. I have not seen any Rail Sounds boxcars recently. I do not have a need for the Rail Sounds cars because all my engines are Legacy or TMCC with Railsounds 5 boards built in. I really like the Freight Sounds cars since they move all around the room as the freight trains traverse the layout. Kind of neat. I put two of them in a 17 car freight.
I remember your PRR TOFC. I had not seen one until your picture so I immediately bought one for my layout. The Reindeer Express Agency car only comes out at Christmas.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
This is the fleet as of now, but I have a complete 314AW and a 370 on the way... Various freight cars that have not yet been back on the track yet, just getting the 300AC running well, lights on and cars staying coupled has proven more involved than I had imagined! The bug has returned though. :)
Wood Rectangle Automotive tire Circuit component Audio equipment

This is how I received my fathers 314AW... I don't think there is enough there to warrant a rebuild, but maybe over time if parts show up cheap enough.
Purple Toy Plant Pink Doll

This is the train I am currently running around the tree. 300AC, repainted pullman(?) cars, and my dads original 630 caboose, one side of which is nearly white from sunbleach.
Train Wheel Vehicle Rolling stock Railway

283 from a set I picked up, have only maintained it and run it once. It came with boxed cars, I am leaving them be and waiting for my knuckle coupler order to come in so I can make a couple transition cars so that I can use my fathers old collection with it.
Will add the 314AW and 370 when they show up!
Take care,
TimmyD
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
Your passenger cars are 650's, what I referred to as New Haven cars. The prototypes were known as Osgood-Bradley style cars. The set would have included a 651 baggage car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
Your passenger cars are 650's, what I referred to as New Haven cars. The prototypes were known as Osgood-Bradley style cars. The set would have included a 651 baggage car.
I purchased the New Haven cars as a set of three repaints a few weeks ago. The third had a goofy custom tail light installed. I am removing that and will put a knuckle coupler on it when those arrive, hopefully today. The PO cut the coupler portion off of the truck to accommodate the tail light. After pulling the shell, they were originally green. I think the PO was going for a Polar Express theme, which works just fine for the tree!
Thanks and have a good day!
TimmyD
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
105 Posts
This just showed up on my doorstep... Looking forward to going through it after the holidays, but out of the box the reverse unit is working properly, and it will travel (barely) in both directions. I will clean and lube it before any more test runs, just wanted to know what I had received since I bought it as used untested. :)
Wheel Vehicle Automotive tire Train Motor vehicle
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,227 Posts
Other than some dust it looks near perfect. Barely any scratches and no dents on the coupler bar. It must not have been run very much. I wish it was mine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,549 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1,060 ·
Really nice Timmy. I do not have any old AF diesels. You have something very cool there. And it runs.
 
1041 - 1060 of 1096 Posts
Top